AVNOnline.com senior editor MJ McMahon visited actor Tom Sizemore at the residential rehabilitation facility where he is being treated for methamphetamine dependency while awaiting a Sept. 15 sentencing hearing for violating parole. What follows is the entire transcript of their conversation. – Ed.
AVNOnline.com: How are you doing in here?
Tom Sizemore: I've been here 56 days today and it's been a difficult time, but the consequences to this drug abuse, regardless of how it started – it started essentially because of what happened with that girl… [stops to talk to passersby]
This New Orleans thing, and I'm digressing here, is just awful. It's hard to be funny, but in regards to myself, I've interrupted the behavior of what I was doing. The consequences of this repeated drug use is unacceptable to me. It's going to end up with dire consequences to me that I'm not willing to have in my life. That's why I came in here after all the terrible things that have happened. I just wanted to get better and I'm willing to get better, which is really the key, because I've been in and out of that type of behavior, and I've been in here long enough to interrupt the behavior and take a good, hard look at what's happened. My ability is to essentially write my life and get on with it. It's been going really well, and this is a great place.
AVNO: In the footage, you talked about having sex with girls in rehab. Is that happening here?
TS: No, not at all. I never took rehab serious before. I was always doing it for someone else – Bob Deniro, my mother, all kinds of people that aren't me. That kind of behavior… you can joke with people. There are a lot of people in here. There are 22 people right now in this unit, but I'm not doing anything like that – no objectifying of women, no rehab sex.
AVNO: Speaking some of the commentary on the tapes…
TS: I haven't seen the tapes yet. [laughs] Oh, you don't believe me? [laughs] Did you like it?
AVNO: There was some humorous stuff in there; a lot of good footage. It seems like, because of some of the commentary, that you meant for other people to see these. Is that the case?
TS: I think, well, I know, because when I was arrested the first time I had the intuitive sense that this was going to get really bad. In a strange, stark way, I thought, "Wouldn't it be interesting to see some person – that would be me – who had seemingly everything lose a great a deal of it?" I had no idea it would be this steep of height that I fell, but it has been.
What I did was I bought a bunch of cameras with the idea that I would shoot a documentary, which I've done, in a way. We have a bunch of footage that isn't just fucking. I'm still going to do it: "Hollywood De-evolution: Tom Sizemore's Nightmare." [says hi to a woman; thanks her for kind words] She heard the interview with Mancow this morning. I did an interview with Mancow this morning – a 22-minute live interview. [says hi to another woman]
Anyway, so I bought six of these Sony three-chip DV camcorders and put them up in my house, and I rolled with my own and I would turn it on when something interesting was happening. I was actually talking, at times, to what I hoped would be a lot of viewers about what I was going through. That kind of translated into… Look, I was living with six to nine women for two years. I don't want the moral majority to attack my penis, but… [laughs] It would be hard for them to do it, it's so large. [laughs] I'm joking.
So, when I was fucking all these broads, it was a performance piece that lasted three years where I would address the camera and I was talking to the greater you. "You" was whoever was watching. There's, I think, probably a lot of anger in there and cynicism about the legal system, rehabs, and what I was going through. I became very disillusioned, because I didn't do anything wrong. That anyone believed that girl – she was basically just part of my disease, and I kicked her out and slammed the door on her like I'm doing with this disease now. I was very angry.
I think underneath that there was a lot of anger because of what I was going through, although when I'm screwing I'm having a lot of fun. There's nothing wrong with fucking. If there were no fucking, there'd be no people. I've always felt that people who don't like fucking should maybe see a psychiatrist. And I don't have a lot of sexual jealousy. I just don't. I was raised in a kind-of hippy environment, and it was whatever you want to do. Two consenting adults, or as it was with me, 10 [laughs] – me and nine others… Everyone is of age. I wasn't checking IDs at the door, but I met everybody basically at the door.
So I was, in fact, talking to the larger, I don't know, people who were jacking off in the country and hoping that they would tune in. [laughs] Not really. Those tapes essentially take place at night. So you have a day like most people. I was working through a lot of this, believe it or not. I have seven movies in the can. So at night, it was just an extension of what I was doing during the day, except I have my clothes on during the day and had them off at night.
AVNO: The women in the tapes, I don't know who any of them are.
TS: That's okay.
AVNO: Who are they?
TS: I don't know who any of them are either. [laughs] There's a couple in there that were, you know, the old guard. Girls like me, they always have. I've been pretty fortunate [stops to talk to a man] Listen, I don't want to tell who these gals are. One of them is kind of famous now. I have some footage of some really famous broads.
AVNO: Liz Hurley?
TS: Oh, I don't know. I really can't remember their names either. I'm not a movie fan. I'm a porn fan. Tera Patrick is my favorite actress.
AVNO: Are you a fan of models?
TS: If they're amenable to my requests. [laughs] My favorite actresses are Belladonna and Tera Patrick. No, I have some footage of some famous women, but for me to release that shit, you've got to get a signature from someone in order to do it, and this whole thing jumped off while I was in treatment. So, when I was told "there's some tape circulating with you in some compromising positions," I said "what's compromising about fucking?" Everybody does it and I didn't have the wherewithal to try to stop this shit. I was exhausted with all the legal entanglements, and if people are angry about other people having sex, then I think they should stop having sex themselves. It's a natural outgrowth of being an adult. It's one of the nice ones.
AVNO: Do you know how the tape got out?
TS: I have an idea. There are a couple girls in there… I lived with several girls during this whole debacle. I was living with them before the debacle, but, you know, the mainstays were there, but there were a lot of satellite girls that are not going to run for public office or anything – although maybe they should in light of Bush's handling of the New Orleans disaster. He's a fuckin' piss ant.
AVNO: I saw a picture of him somewhere earlier this week receiving an honorary guitar from some country singer.
TS: That's what he should be doing. I mean, there are thousands of people dying in New Orleans. I'd be getting a guitar too. That fucking asshole… He should be there siphoning water out and trying to save people's lives. I mean, there's no fucking army in this country? This is goddam America, man. It doesn't seem like America. It's just awful. I don't want to get off on a tangent, but it's just horrible.
AVNO: Anyway, back to the sex…
TS: [laughs] Back to the sex – always a nice place to repair to.
AVNO: Is it fair to say you're an ass man?
TS: [laughs] It's fair to say. I think it's really fair to say. Is that what you saw on the tapes – a lot of good asses?
AVNO: Yeah, a lot of ass stuff.
TS: There's a lot of good ass stuff, isn't there? Well, generally speaking, when you meet a girl, or anybody, your first response is to how they look. Anyway, I don't want to go into that. Yeah, I like a real sturdy ass.
AVNO: The footage is edited pretty cleanly, and you obviously had multiple cameras going. Did you edit it?
TS: I had six cameras going, and I don't know if I cut it together or not. I started cutting together some straight footage, and I did start to cut together what I called "triple-X fuck tapes." I'm not sure what's out there, but obviously it's me. I want to win an AVN Award. [laughs]
AVNO: Can we talk about the girl?
TS: Flying Fleiss?
AVNO: Yeah.
TS: Sure.
AVNO: You said in the footage: "I didn't hit her. I didn't like her because every time I'd go somewhere she'd suck every cock in the room." Care to expand on that?
TS: Kind of self explanatory, isn't it? Either she sucked every cock before or she was working on finishing off the other dicks in the room. It was difficult to walk into a room – Warren Beatty said this once – and the woman you're with has either sucked every cock or been fucked by everyone. It kind of ruins your dinner. Listen, I have nothing to say about her. I've never said anything negative about her, and I'm not going to start now. I just have to say she's a liar.
AVNO: You also said in the footage that you shit on her because she asked you to. True?
TS: [laughs] I don't recall ever saying that in a public venue or a private venue, but no, I have never shit on anyone. Metaphorically speaking I may have, but in actuality I have never shit on anyone, including the liar.
AVNO: There are some inflammatory comments made about the LAPD. What sticks out is this one: "I hope 22 cops are murdered over the weekend."
TS: I don't recall saying that, and I don't believe it. I don't feel that way at all. They haven't been very nice to me, but they're just doing their jobs. They're ordered to do things, and I've had numerous cops be very kind to me through this thing and actually say to me, "C'mon man: Get it together, because we're going to keep coming up here because we're told to come up here." I don't feel that way. If I said it I was obviously joking or probably intoxicated, but I don't feel that way at all. I come from a military family. I don't feel that way at all.
AVNO: I'm assuming drugs were involved when you shot this stuff.
TS: I don't know, I'd have to see it, but, you know, I was on and off drugs through this whole period. To have someone with no evidence, 14 months after we were split, say "He hit me two-and-a-half years ago…." I've never hit a woman in my life. Whatever these tapes have on them, they're probably showing that I'm a very considerate person. To have someone say something so awful about you and then repeatedly say it to these tabloid, tattler, garbage, motherfucking magazines…. You know, she's pole vaulting over my celebrity, yet I've never said one negative word about her in print. I don't have anything bad to say about her. I just want her to go away. She's a cough. You just want the cough to end.
AVNO: Any chance the Liz Hurley tape is going to come out?
TS: I don't even really know who she is. Who is she? I dated someone named Elizabeth in the early '90s. It might be the same person. She's a very, very nice person, and she had a famous boyfriend, and she was really pretty. She chumped out Bing-a-ling [Hurley's ex-boyfriend, Steve Bing] and then called him Osama Bing Laden, which I thought was kind of below the belt, but she's never been… Well, she was below the belt once in a while. [laughs] But she's a really good mother and a tower of strength. She's a really great gal that I haven't seen in a long time… I think.
What other famous people have I slept with?
AVNO: Do you want to tell me?
TS: I'm not going to name any names. I don't kiss and tell. One of the things that's happened through this whole debacle is… I'm a private guy. I don't want this shit. I didn't want to be in the paper. I didn't want the press. I just wanted to do my job. I was just an actor. Who could have known that Heidi Fleiss on May 8, 2003, would have me arrested and I would end up in this horror show of publicity? I don't want to be in the paper. I just want to act and do my job. That's what I'm in here doing. I'm reclaiming my better self, and I'm going to come out of here and reclaim my career. I in no way want to pull anyone into this. I've seen how unfair people can be to celebrities first-hand now with myself and before that with other people I was friends with, and I in no way want to bring someone into this who either isn't here to defend themselves or say it's okay, etc.
AVNO: You have a court date coming up on Sept. 15. How do you feel about your prospects?
TS: I came in here of my own volition, of my own accord, on July 11. I went to court on the 20th or 21st of July, and the judge remanded me to stay here until Sept. 15. It sounded harsh, but it wasn't harsh, because I was going to stay here anyway. I don't really recall going to court because I was heavily medicated. I really don't recall any of that first 15 days in here. To get me off these other drugs they had me on these sedating drugs. I have two children now and I'm hoping that, like most people in the country, I'm allowed to proceed with seeking gainful employment and taking care of my family. That's what I'm hoping will happen.
AVNO: You also mentioned in the footage that this ordeal has cost you $14 million. Is that accurate?
TS: It has cost me that: $14 million in two-and-a-half years, and I'm in debt.
AVNO: If you look at other celebrity sex tapes – Paris Hilton and Pam Anderson in particular – they've done wonders for their careers. Do you see this as a springboard for you?
TS: Well, I haven't seen the footage. Do I fuck good in them?
AVNO: Yes.
TS: [laughs] Well, if I fuck good in them, I don't see how that could be a bad thing in the end.
AVNO: How has Hollywood treated you through your struggles with the legal system and drugs?
TS: Hollywood is a very forgiving place, because a lot of people in Hollywood have the same problems. There are a lot of good feelings for me out there, I think. I didn't think so before, but now that I'm clean I can hear it, I can feel it, and I'm going to keep my eyes on that. Basically, I want to keep my eyes on myself, and I want God to keep his eye on me. I've always believed in God, but I kind of got lost.
I was very disillusioned by what happened in court the first go-around. Unfortunately, I'm entangled in the legal system now, and I just have to wait it out. I think I'm good at what I do. I don't think I'm great, but if someone is good at what they do and they get better – like an athlete that tears his hamstring, he gets better, and if he was a starter, he expects to start again. You've got to lose your job on the field. So if I'm going to lose my job, I want to lose my job in front of a camera.
AVNO: Do you think the sex tape is going to have any effect on getting serious roles after this?
TS: I don't think so, but if it does maybe I could direct Tera Patrick and Belladonna in my first feature.
AVNO: Any ambition to star in or direct adult films?
TS: If I can get Tera Patrick, Belladonna, Jenna Jameson, and Lanny Barbie in the same movie… My manager would probably sit on me, but if I could crawl over him I might want to do that. I'm not sure. [laughs]
AVNO: People joke that it seems like you're in every war movie made in the last 10 years…
TS: Well, that's not true. I was in three. I had starring roles in two of them – Saving Private Ryan and Black Hawk Down –and I was in Pearl Harbor. I guess they mean that my performances left such an imprint on their imagination that they imagined that I'm in all the war movies.
AVNO: How do you feel about adult films?
TS: I like adult films a lot. I think the girls are really pretty. Adult films to me are about beauty and sex. I don't like this bukkake shit. I watched part of one once and said, "turn that shit off." I think adult films are, for men, to be with the most perfect, beautiful, accommodating woman, and it's kind of a wishful thing that you could be with a Jenna Jameson or Tera and she would be so accommodating to you whenever you wanted to make love. They're beautiful girls, and they're accommodating to you – they want to, too. I think it's a lot tamer than these freaks that are anti-porn or anti-sex – I don't know what you call it. I don't even like the word porn, because it has the connotation of something negative, and it's not for most of the viewers of it. They watch it, they go to work, they have kids, etc. They're not sitting in a motel room with a long trench coat on. Ninety-nine percent are not that person. They're regular people doing regular, normal things. It's a nice thing. It's like watching movies.
AVNO: Word is you're planning a TV show.
TS: It's in development. It's called Super Sizemore. It's a reality show, so maybe I'll be Paris number two. [laughs] No, I've never seen [The Simple Life], but she's a beautiful gal.
AVNO: In light of your directorial debut, who's a better director: you or Spielberg?
TS: Oh, Steven is far better. [laughs] You knew the answer to that. I'm an actor, but I would like to direct some things I have going on.
AVNO: Anything else you'd like to talk about?
TS: Well, if you like sex go to Triple-X-Tom-dot-com and lose yourself in my former pastime. There are a lot of really pretty girls; a man who falls into the hole in Alice in Wonderland. It's kind of funny and it's kind of sexy, I heard. I saw the trailer: It's three minutes long. If you want to know what it's like to be a movie star who has a lot of silly things on his mind… Well, they're not really silly. I'm falling into bed with six to eight pretty girls every night. People might think that's awful, but I'm here and I can say it wasn't awful at all. [laughs]
